EC members and information gathering

[Howard C. Berkowitz]

There are various areas in which the EC has simply not yet established operating policies, and, in some cases, I personally think a common-sense approach may help.  For example, I want to start an internal discussion/project on what I'll generally call mentoring: the collection of useful Author and Editor experiences, some produced in the form of guides for creating, lower-case editing, and guiding articles. Other information, such as tricks in formatting or citations, may simply be collected, or perhaps put into the help system so they can be answers to questions.

Some individual EC members have expressed that such investigation, early in writing or presenting a proposal for EC discussion, should only be done with EC approval. To me, that's backward, and also quite different from getting feedback on a specific, formal EC proposal.

What is the Citizen feeling here?

[Aleta Curry]

Well, *this* citizen's feeling is that if 'some individual EC members' have expressed that it should be done with EC approval, what is your reason for circumventing that and asking what the Citizen feeling is here?  Why do you feel that because *you* think the idea is 'backward', you are within your rights to treat members of the EC with disrespect?  There were seven persons elected, Howard.

[Howard C. Berkowitz]

Well, *this* citizen's feeling is that if 'some individual EC members' have expressed that it should be done with EC approval, what is your reason for circumventing that and asking what the Citizen feeling is here?  Why do you feel that because *you* think the idea is 'backward', you are within your rights to treat members of the EC with disrespect?  There were seven persons elected, Howard.

First, because those I will treat with greatest respect are the Citizens. If, as it seems, I am in Opposition, then I might never be able to do anything for constituents if the majority disapproves.

Second, because it was not an official position of the EC. It was the opinion of perhaps two members, and perhaps with ulterior motives.

Third, there has never been a motion that the council, acting as a whole, must preapprove any action in advance.  There certainly was no preapproval of arranging an indictment.  Loosely, the model of a legislature applies to the council. Do you know of a legislature that requires a legislator to seek the approval of the legislature before getting constituent approval?

Fourth, every Council member is ultimately responsible to the Citizens.

Fifth, it strikes me as insane that an elected official can't research a subject.

[Peter Jackson]

Agreed, basically. It's a matter of free discussion.

[Martin Baldwin-Edwards]

For the information of Citizens, I should point out that there is a detailed draft proposal on the wiki, for Communication with the Citizens -- as the EC is required to do. It sets up various consultation mechanisms, which are important for us to develop policy. I have already discussed it with the ME, who has been asking for us to deal with this matter as a priority.

http://locke.citizendium.org/cz_ec/EC-2010-009

[Replace]

Text was provided here, explaining very clearly what has been happening on the EC. It has been deleted by the Constabulary. I have to conclude that we cannot answer Citizens' questions on why the EC is doing what it is, and the Forums are not an appropriate place for such discussions. We also had this problem in the election campaigns, when I objected to the Forum civility policy.

Therefore, I ask the MC to rule that -- since we cannot reply to Citizens' questions here -- that there should be no discussion of any controversial matter relating to the activities of the EC on the Forums. Until this policy is clarified, I will not answer any more questions and will ask the Constabulary to delete all discussions that in my view require open debate which is being suppressed here.

I will answer any questions sent by other means, in a private context.

[Anton Sweeney]

Martin,

There is no bar that I am aware of on answering Citizens' questions on why the EC is doing what it is.  The text was removed by me as it was inflammatory.

Regards,

Anton

[Howard C. Berkowitz]

For the information of Citizens, I should point out that there is a detailed draft proposal on the wiki, for Communication with the Citizens -- as the EC is required to do. It sets up various consultation mechanisms, which are important for us to develop policy. I have already discussed it with the ME, who has been asking for us to deal with this matter as a priority.

http://locke.citizendium.org/cz_ec/EC-2010-009

The EC has not voted to authorize unilateral member communications with the ME, MC, or Ombudsman. Now, I will say that is ridiculously bureaucratic. Were you voted to be the EC's representative?

However, it seems that even a request for opinion of mine has been attacked, yet there have been numerous communications, apparently including a request for setting up an impeachment.  Is this balanced, or are personalities involved?

[Martin Baldwin-Edwards]

I have asked the constabulary to delete this and record it in Howard's file.

[Howard C. Berkowitz]

I have asked the constabulary to delete this and record it in Howard's file.

Ah. My dossier. Round up the usual suspects.

Exactly how is a review of the actual rules inflammatory?