Why do we have a [[Sulfur]] article and also a [[Sulphur]] article?

[Tom Morris]

If you do A-level (age 16-18) Chemistry in Britain, you have to write "sulfur". I'm a big defender of Americanisms (I love, for instance, the description of a car being "t-boned"), but these are silly. It's AL-YOU-MIN-I-UM (think "minimum" without the penultimate 'm').

Aesthetics aside, CZ is written in en_US, so sulfur should be the article name with a redirect from sulphur.

[Martin Baldwin-Edwards]

CZ is not written in US English. You have the right, if you start an article, to set the language variant that everyone else must follow. Furthermore, I don't see why the spelling of sulphur has to be American in British schools: we merely need to be aware of the US variant. This is yet another "dumbing down" of British education.

[Howard C. Berkowitz]

CZ is not written in US English. You have the right, if you start an article, to set the language variant that everyone else must follow. Furthermore, I don't see why the spelling of sulphur has to be American in British schools: we merely need to be aware of the US variant. This is yet another "dumbing down" of British education.

Sulfur is not an Americanism; it is the international standard name for the element. IUPAC is not a language variant; it's a chemistry invariant.

In other areas, there are international standards. The World Health Organization is promulgating a list of international nonproprietary names for drugs, so we won't need to worry if it's pethidine or meperidine, paracetamol or acetaminophen, or the German and French variants I seem to remember from the NATO medical handbook.

[Larry Sanger]

Tom's open-mindedness toward Americanism is refreshing, but he is incorrect that CZ is written in American English (and Martin is correct in stating our policy here).  I would quibble with Howard and say that "Sulfur" (the word, not the element) is not MERELY an Americanism, it is ALSO the international standard name according to the IUPAC.  Whether this means WE should use "sulfur" is another matter, but it sounds plausible to me.

[Martin Baldwin-Edwards]

I did not mean to imply that CZ should not use the IUPAC spelling of sulfur, since it is the more common spelling of the same element. Besides, the Chemistry workgroup has opted for the IUPAC spellings. My point was about what is taught in British schools. Generally, I find it desirable that alternative spellings and grammar (mainly U.S.) are taught in the upper levels of secondary education: I find it appalling that American grammar and spelling have actually supplanted the British forms, without the conscious awareness of school pupils.

[Hayford Peirce]

You won't have to worry about it until you find people named Cholmondely spelling their names Chumly. Or whatever Featherstonehough translates to....

[Howard C. Berkowitz]

I did not mean to imply that CZ should not use the IUPAC spelling of sulfur, since it is the more common spelling of the same element. Besides, the Chemistry workgroup has opted for the IUPAC spellings. My point was about what is taught in British schools. Generally, I find it desirable that alternative spellings and grammar (mainly U.S.) are taught in the upper levels of secondary education: I find it appalling that American grammar and spelling have actually supplanted the British forms, without the conscious awareness of school pupils.

If it doesn't involve too much original research, would you be willing to do a warm-up article, first, on conscious awareness of school pupils (sadly, too often international), and then conscious awareness of the United States electorate? Don't limit the latter to the election, but include paying attention to the care taken by regulators of the financial industry.

On my one terror-filled driving experience in the U.K., from Milton Keynes to Stone to Heathrow (where I kissed the parking lot), I did find an indication that there is at least one aware member of the U.K. electorate. Mercifully, on the motorways, I couldn't sense that I was on the "wrong" side of the road, but still needed the occasional rest stop. 

In one of the gents' facilities, there was one of those normally despicable hot-air hand dryers. It redeemed itself, however, with a neatly lettered sign taped next to the "on" button:

Press for a message from your M.P.

As far as supplanting native spellings, what did you people do to Battenberg-Saxe-Coburg-Gotha ?

[Martin Baldwin-Edwards]

Well, of course, poor old Marx thought that all he had to do was raise class consciousness: it didn't occur to him that a century later some 99% of the society would be unconscious of everything.

THe LH driving is a pain, and I speak as a pedestrian who has lived in RH driving countries for the last 14 years. I am glad (Relieved?) to hear that you find British toilets amusing. Normally, they are so filthy that no amount of witty graffiiti can compensate. Obviously, in the case that you encountered, there was a genuine link with the Members of the House of Commons. I am surprised that you thought the notice to be in jest!

[Tom Morris]

I did see a piece of graffiti in the gents toilets today at University College London. It said "Jez Bentham Woz 'Ere". Which is, in fact, true.

I am now trying to envision a conversation between Karl Marx and Sarah Palin.

Also, the driving on the left thing - sorry about that. You should see the number of road accidents that happen on the exits from the car ferries and the Channel Tunnel. I think the Police had to make the signs more prominent and in more languages explaining that we do indeed drive on the left.

[Howard C. Berkowitz]

I did see a piece of graffiti in the gents toilets today at University College London. It said "Jez Bentham Woz 'Ere". Which is, in fact, true.

I am now trying to envision a conversation between Karl Marx and Sarah Palin.

Also, the driving on the left thing - sorry about that. You should see the number of road accidents that happen on the exits from the car ferries and the Channel Tunnel. I think the Police had to make the signs more prominent and in more languages explaining that we do indeed drive on the left.

I do have a story of Churchill in the gents' at the Commons, but it probably wouldn't pass the family-friendliness policy. I shall email it.

As far as my driving experience, I'm glad I am not one whose masculinity, nay, identity, depends on cars. Unfortunately, I was doing seminars such that there was no way to get a train from one place to the other, and, complaining loudly, I rented a car in Bletchley, and got the 30-second lecture on driving-for-RH-drivers.

They had not mentioned roundabouts. I had no idea which lane I needed to go straight across, and was weaving in traffic. Suddenly, I became aware of flashing blue lights behind me. Muttering that I hoped all I had heard about the courtesy of British police was true, I pulled onto the median.

It was far, far worse than police.

I had been pulled over by an ambulance.

The crew came over, and, quite politely, said "sir, your driving was so erratic that we thought you might have need of our services."

Explaining my utter incomprehension of roundabout rules, they said "Well, we aren't going anywhere specific, and we'd rather not have to give you a ride." Very nicely, they came back with a large sheet of paper, and drew diagrams of Roundabout 101, giving me a quick quiz. When they were satisfied, they parted the waves in front of me, got me into the next roundabout waving directions, and sent me on my way.